Message Monday: Tithe after tax or before? An argument with myself

January 7, 2013 by Steve Stewart 15 Comments

As a Christian, I should follow the instructions of my creator. He says it is good for me to give a tithe so I take his word for it.

For the past year or two we have been giving based on gross income (before tax), and I know we have been blessed by it. But I recently heard Rabbi Daniel Lapin say the tithe is to be after-tax money, not before because tax isn’t money that comes to you.

That doesn’t sound right to me

Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed that the field bringeth forth year by year – Deuteronomy 14:22

Taking a broad look at the scripture, it sounds as if I should give 10% on everything I earn, not just what I bring home. So why would America’s Rabbi say that my interpretation is incorrect?

Argument with myself

The side of me that argues to continue tithing on the gross (Before-tax me) is arguing with the After-tax me.

Before-tax me: I wouldn’t mind giving a smaller tithe if it were the right thing to do.

After-tax me: What makes you think after-tax is the wrong thing?

Before-tax me: Well, my true “increase” would be all my benefits from earning a paycheck. That would include the money I pay to Washington for the privilege of having an organized government (insert your own joke here).

After-tax me: Your employer pays some benefits that you never see on your paycheck. You don’t tithe on those, do you?

Before-tax me: Good point. I never thought of that. But I want to play it safe so I’ll tithe on my known “before-tax” amount.

After-tax me: It isn’t about playing it safe. It’s about being faithful.

Before-tax me: Isn’t the right thing to be giving the correct amount for a tithe?

After-tax me: Tithing is a spiritual thing, not a bill from God. This isn’t a salvation issue Steve.

Before-tax me: Exactly. So I believe I should give on the gross.

After-tax me: You could, but that leaves you with less money to do other things with. You could give more to other charities or take better care of your family if you tithed on the net amount (after-tax).

Before-tax me: Why does it sound like you are selfish?

After-tax me: Hey, you started it. Isn’t Rabbi Lapin a trusted resource of ours? He’s the one that said to tithe after-tax. I’m just agreeing with him.

Before-tax me: Duly noted. All your points have been very logical but I’m still not convinced. Why is that?

After-tax me: Like I said, this is a spiritual thing. You actually don’t have to give anything if you didn’t want to. But if you do believe Jesus Christ’s teachings are his instruction book for we should live our life then you should follow his guide on tithing.

Before-tax me: I am!

After-tax me: So why are we arguing?

Before-tax me: I guess I’m concerned that if you are right then I might become more selfish with that amount which will no longer be given.

After-tax me: Look. If the tithe really is supposed to be based on after-tax income, it means I am right. But I would still be wrong because your belief system is based on faith, and your faith is saying before-tax.

Before-tax me: I’m still confused.

After-tax me: Taxes will do that do ya.

What do you believe? Should I continue tithing on my gross earnings or my after-tax income?

Filed Under: Message Monday

14 comments

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Umoumlex

Well My view : I have no problem on goving tithe on gross income neither on after taxes * if you give on gross income you are blessing everything • if you give on after taxes you are blessing what you bring home which mean when you do your taxes you give tithe from what you get back. I believe TITHE IS ABOUT FAITH NOT GOOD DEED!

EnnisP1

1 Like

@Umoumlex

Tithing is definitely a matter of faith but it is also a money management issue and money requires precise handling. We should figure out exactly what a tithe is and commit to contributing by that formula, prayerfully looking for God's blessing as we do. Otherwise we shouldn't call it a tithe.

Since God's promised blessing was originally attached to the tithe, not generosity or giving generally, we should figure out exactly what that was before we assume His blessing on whatever a person decides to do.

MoneyMasterMom

1 Like

We give a percentage of our gross income. It's not because the old testament tells us too, but because its generally challenges us to give trusting God. I think when you start having the internal conversation about before or after tax you're just trying to rationalize giving less. Don't cheap out on God, heaven knows he didn't cheap out on us.

EnnisP1

@MoneyMasterMom

Yes, but, if we judge people who tithe on after-tax money as cheap, should we judge people who tithe on pre-tax money as braggarts?

I'm asking, not saying.

Umoumlex

Just to keep in prospect the before Christ with the after Christ PAYING TAXES (Matthew 22:15-22 CEVUK) The Pharisees got together and planned how they could trick Jesus into saying something wrong. They sent some of their followers and some of Herod's followers to say to him, “Teacher, we know that you are honest. You teach the truth about what God wants people to do. And you treat everyone with the same respect, no matter who they are. Tell us what you think! Should we pay taxes to the Emperor or not?” Jesus knew their evil thoughts and said, “Why are you trying to test me? You show-offs! Let me see one of the coins used for paying taxes.” They brought him a silver coin, and he asked, “Whose picture and name are on it?” “The Emperor's,” they answered. Then Jesus told them, “Give the Emperor what belongs to him and give God what belongs to God.” His answer surprised them so much that they walked away. (Matthew 22:15-22 CEVUK)

EnnisP1

The Levites, who received the tithe, were responsible for many things our taxes pay the government to do: maintain penal system, legal system and educational functions. The Levites even had medical responsibilities so deducting taxes before you calculate your tithe is not only fair but biblical also.

MoneyPlanSOS moderator

@EnnisP1 Now that I think about it, you make a great point. :)

Question: That view is Old Testament. Are we still beholden to it? (I could write another argument with myself on that one!)

EnnisP1

2 Like

@MoneyPlanSOS

True, it is Old Testament but if we use the term "tithe" aren't we borrowing from the OT?

Are we beholden to tithe? I think a better question is, are we thoughtful? Do we dismiss everything in the OT relative to tithing or should we study it carefully to determine exactly how it worked?

And another question: Is the act of giving mandated? I would say yes. The NT law of reaping and sowing applies. It's a personal choice, yes, but like smoking or not smoking, there are unavoidable consequences attached.

But, if giving is mandated, whether we want to give or not, like it or not, is there anything wrong with deferring to the formulas of the OT to decide how much to give?

Is there anything in the NT that demands more than a tithe? That is what many grace givers imply but that creates a "law" without detail, "you must give more but we can't say how much more." And then it becomes a contest to see who can sacrifice the most. Not very Christian.

In fact, "grace givers" are just as coercive and manipulative, or more so, than those who teach tithing.

So, OT tithing as a rule of thumb makes sense to me even if it isn't an absolute law.

My thought is, whatever we do now should be based on an understanding of what was done then. And, yes, I use OT tithing, as precisely as I can understand it, as a PRINCIPLE to guide my giving.

MrJoshuaBrown

I have had this argument with myself too.

AverageJoeMoney

"Tithing is a spiritual thing, not a bill from God. This isn’t a salvation issue Steve."

I totally agree, which is my point: gift what you can, which is at least the after-tax amount, but hopefully the pre-tax amount.

Umoumlex

Remember God was the "government " the tribe of Levi was the "church"

Umoumlex

Hey Steve I think this might give some ligth about taxes and tithe (Numbers 31:1-54 CEVUK) The Lord said to Moses, “Before you die, make sure that the Midianites are punished for what they did to Israel.” Then Moses told the people, “The Lord wants to punish the Midianites. So tell our men to prepare for battle. Each tribe will send a thousand men to fight.” Twelve thousand men were picked from the tribes of Israel, and after they were prepared for battle, Moses sent them off to war. Phinehas the son of Eleazar went with them and took along some things from the sacred tent and the trumpets for sounding the battle signal. The Israelites fought against the Midianites, just as the Lord had commanded Moses. They killed all the men, including Balaam son of Beor and the five Midianite kings, Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba. The Israelites captured every woman and child, then led away the Midianites' cattle and sheep, and took everything else that belonged to them. They also burnt down the Midianite towns and villages. Israel's soldiers gathered together everything they had taken from the Midianites, including the captives and the animals. Then they returned to their own camp in the hills of Moab across the River Jordan from Jericho, where Moses, Eleazar, and the other Israelite leaders met the troops outside camp. Moses became angry with the army commanders and said, “I can't believe you let the women live! They are the ones who followed Balaam's advice and invited our people to worship the god Baal-Peor. That's why the Lord punished us by killing so many of our people. You must put to death every boy and all the women who have ever had sex. But do not kill the young women who have never had sex. You may keep them for yourselves.” Then Moses said to the soldiers, “If you killed anyone or touched a dead body, you are unclean and have to stay outside the camp for seven days. On the third and seventh days, you must go through a ceremony to make yourselves and your captives clean. Then wash your clothes and anything made from animal skin, goat's hair, or wood.” Eleazar then explained, “If you need to purify something that won't burn, such as gold, silver, bronze, iron, tin, or lead, you must first place it in a hot fire. After you take it out, sprinkle it with the water that purifies. Everything else should only be sprinkled with the water. Do all of this, just as the Lord commanded Moses. Wash your clothes on the seventh day, and after that, you will be clean and may return to the camp.” The Lord told Moses: Make a list of everything taken from the Midianites, including the captives and the animals. Then divide them between the soldiers and the rest of the people. Eleazar the priest and the family leaders will help you. From the half that belongs to the soldiers, set aside for the Lord one out of every five hundred people or animals and give these to Eleazar. From the half that belongs to the people, set aside one out of every fifty and give these to the Levites in charge of the sacred tent. Moses and Eleazar followed the Lord 's instructions and listed everything that had been taken from the Midianites. The list included 675,000 sheep and goats, 72,000 cattle, 61,000 donkeys, and 32,000 young women who had never had sex. Each half included 337,500 sheep and goats, 36,000 cattle, 30,500 donkeys, and 16,000 young women. From the half that belonged to the soldiers, Moses counted out 675 sheep and goats, 72 cattle, 61 donkeys, and 32 women and gave them to Eleazar to be dedicated to the Lord . Then from the half that belonged to the people, Moses set aside one out of every fifty animals and women, as the Lord had said, and gave them to the Levites. The army commanders went to Moses and said, “Sir, we have counted our troops, and not one soldier is missing. So we want to give the Lord all the gold jewellery we took from the Midianites. It's our gift to him for watching over us and our troops.” Moses and Eleazar accepted the jewellery from the commanders, and its total weight was nearly two hundred kilogrammes. This did not include the things that the soldiers had kept for themselves. So Moses and Eleazar placed the gold in the Lord 's sacred tent to remind Israel of what had happened. (Numbers 31:1-54 CEVUK)